181 | Live Fully, Work Simply with Carson Tate
Our guest today on the pod is Carson Tate. Carson is the founder & Managing Partner of Working Simply, a speaker, a coach and the author of the best selling book Work Simply: Embracing the Power of Your Personal Productivity Style. Her views have been included in top tier business media including Bloomberg Businessweek, Business Insider, CBS Money Watch, Fast Company, Harvard Business Review, New York Times, USA Today and more. Her new book is Own It, Love It and Make it Work.
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Carson Tate Awarepreneurs Interview
SPEAKERS: Carson Tate, Paul Zelizer
Paul Zelizer 00:01
Hi, this is Paul Zelizer, and welcome to another episode of the Awarepreneurs Podcast. This podcast is all about the intersection of three things, conscious business, social impact, and awareness practices. Each episode, I do a deep dive interview with a thought leader in this intersection. Someone who has market tested experience and is already transforming many lives. Before I introduce today's topic in our guest, I have one request. If you could go over to iTunes or whatever app you're listening to the show on and do a rating and hit the subscribe button. It really makes a difference. Thanks so much.
Today, I am thrilled to introduce you to Carson Tate. And our topic today is live fully work simply. Carson is the Founder and Managing Partner of working simply a speaker, a coach and the author of the best selling book work simply embracing the power of your personal productivity style. Her views have been included in Top Tier Business media, including Bloomberg Business, Business Insider, CBS moneywatch, Fast Company, Harvard Business Review, New York Times, USA today and a whole lot more. her new book is called own it, love it and make it work. Carson, welcome to the show. Thank you, Paul, I'm glad to be with you. Such an honor. That was quite a bio here, we could have been here much, much longer if I read all the things but I think our audience got a sense that you've been at this a while. I have Yes. So we're called the were printers, Carson. And one of the ways we like to get to know somebody is to ask you about a wellness or an awareness practice that you personally use to resource yourself and bring your best self to this work day after day, week after week. So probably like many of your listeners, my practice is meditation, and actually practice two forms. So the seated meditation, you know, quiet on using my breath. Sometimes I'll listen to a guided meditation, sometimes it's mantra. But I've recently started incorporating walking meditation. And I have found that very restorative. And also I've gotten some great fresh insights that have helped my writing immensely. You know, there's a lot of research about what happens when we walk and the creativity that comes with that. So I'll put a link to that people on the show know, I'm like a, I'm a research and neuroscience geek. But just so you know, that's there's some really great research about walking, particularly in nature and the kind of creativity that that releases. So yeah, you're, I love that practice.
Carson Tate 02:35
So there's a there's a quote on your site, Carson, that just that got my attention. It says, work is not something we do work, it's an expression of who we are. Is that like, Have you always been somebody who's been thinking about working and who we are and purpose and meaning? And like, how did that come onto your radar. And if you were to put a pin on a map somewhere in your journey, really started to get interested in work and meaning and purpose and simplicity and living fully? Where might that pin start? That 10 starts Paul and my first job out of undergrad. I was six weeks and to a leadership development program at a financial services company and my colleagues who run the program with me, we were invited to a lunch with the CEO of this company. It was a fortune 50 company and all of his direct reports. So the C suite. So you can imagine Paul at 23 having this opportunity, it was just unbelievable. And my colleagues and I were so excited the day came could hardly contain ourselves. We're all in our best black suits. And we go up to the conference room. And we sit down in our places. And the CEO starts introducing each of his team members. And my eye is immediately drawn to a woman at the far end of the table. And she looks miserable. She has that gray poller of someone who's been sick for a while her shoulders are hunched over. She stands out in contrast to the rest of these executives. And as the CEO gets to her, he says and this is our Chief Human Resources officer. It's her name. She stands up and starts talking to us. And I can't look away from her eyes. They look dead. They're blank. And I had this moment. It's like, oh no. If this is what success looks like, I'm on the wrong bus.
Paul Zelizer 04:52
But where's the ripcord? I'm pulling the ripcord
Carson Tate 04:55
exactly what has happened And 23 years old, I wish I could say I was that evolved that immediately it's like, you got to find more purpose and meaning. But I, it took a few years for me to start to really dive in deep and realize that work is meant to be the full expression of who we are. And work is meant to serve us serve the world and really connect us in a deep way to our own authentic spirit. And I don't ever want to be that Chief Human Resources officer, or have anyone have that same experience and believe that they have to work that way. But a powerful story I concern the think of times where I've, you know, encountered people and organizations, yeah, the same thing. It's like, Hello, is there anybody home? Is there a human in there somewhere, right? Like, I'm sure if you like, meet them in your community, or you're volunteering together, the kids are playing soccer, or you're talking about something you're both passionate about it? It's not like it completely extinguishes, but like they put on that I don't even know how to describe it like walking zombie, you know, being to go to work. And it's so painful to see.
Paul Zelizer 06:18
I imagine Carson, you're pretty familiar with like, the research on disengagement at work. And how many people you know, this isn't just like a minor phenomenon. Is that fair to say? That is fair to say poll it. Gallup, their latest numbers show 64% of the US workforce is disengaged, which I would consider an epidemic. So this is abysmal. And the health cost of this disengagement, the mental cost of the disengagement and then the organizational cost in terms of loss of productivity and profitability, customer service. All of these I think are we can no longer tolerate. and talk to us a little bit about what what are some of the costs like to start with, like the health part, the health and well being of somebody who goes to work, and is disengaged, and maybe even describe if some of our listeners don't know what that word means? They probably get a sense of it, but like, how would you describe disengagement and what happens to the, we'll talk about the effect on the organization. But what happens to an individual who goes to work and is not fully engaged. Mm hmm. So a disengaged team member, as that team member, that might show up at work, but isn't there. So they're physically on the zoom call, but you can tell that their mind is elsewhere, that disengaged team member might actively be vocalizing discontent with the organization, their productivity might or might not be declining. There's this persistent refrain of, I don't want to go to work. I don't feel fulfilled, there's not a connection or purpose in my work, it lacks meaning not a connection to a deeper Why will also show up with that disengaged person. And so what happens when someone is chronically disengaged is more cortisol is released in the system, which is a chemical stress response. And so as cortisol is elevated in your systems, it can lead to more colds, headaches, weight gain, so some very physical symptoms, and then the mental cost. So let's say you come to work and you're very stressed, disengaged, you might be working for a challenging manager, you then take that home, that stress goes home to your family, and it can go and be pervasive for the route the community in a very negative way. Yeah, thanks for describing that. I remember reading research about when most heart attacks happen, and they happen between Sunday night and Monday morning, right? So these are profound, this is not just like, Oh, well, I'm a little less happy. I'm not like, you know, maybe I'm not running marathons, but it'll be fine. We're talking major, major, especially if somebody's disengaged, not just for like a short term, but if they're disengaged year after year, the health consequences of that are just stunning, right?
Carson Tate 09:25
And as he said, close to two thirds of Americans are disengaged right here right now. Actually, I think that research was before Coronavirus. I'm not sure if it went up or down. Well, what's interesting is I pulled some data, I wanted to make sure it's prepared fall and so in May, Gallup did another pulse survey. And disengagement went up seven percentage points in May. It has now gone back down and it's still hovering at that 64 to 65 really 65% that is shared earlier will say two out of three Americans 66% would technically be two out of three, well, let's call it two out of three people who go to work in America aren't happy to be there and are, you know, building up their kind of a queueing negative interest in their health, well being spiritual, you know, four to two, etc. Every day they come to work. That's powerful. So you're like, there's an opportunity there. Right? Carson is obviously an entrepreneur. So Wow, that's a mass I want to go play in those waters. So talk to us, like from 23. We'll talk about what you know, working simply looks like right now. But it's like quite an extensive company. Like, how did you get into I want to play in those waters around disengagement and living a life that's really aligned with your values?
Carson Tate 10:54
We started first poll with addressing the dizziness and overwhelm that also consumes us. So I started my work, looking at the stress level around having more to do than hours in the day, and the impact that that takes on your mental, spiritual and physical well being, as my team and started working with our clients and helping them be more organized, more efficient, what happened is we create a capacity, that capacity to get through the day and reflect. And so what started happening in our training sessions and our coaching sessions, once folks were more organized, they started asking questions about, is this all there is to work in life? I can do the work I feel in control. But what's the meaning? What's the purpose? I'm not sure I'm really that fulfilled and engaged. I'm no longer spinning out of control when I'm recognizing this job doesn't align with who I am. So I started digging into the engagement issue and doing research and working on models. How do we help these folks? And that's where the second book came from. And the interest I would say, in this space. So give our listeners a context. We'd like to talk about our entrepreneur classes, Carson, like put on your entrepreneur, like when did you start this company? And it started with productivity, and then it expanded out and I want to talk to you about the second book, but like, just give us like a little grounding on like, when did it start? And it? Was it always a company? Or did you start solo and grow it from there, just give us a little entrepreneurial skill. Hello up? Thank you. Yes. So it started as me as a as a solo entrepreneur, and I started maybe, the way a lot of your listeners might have started, it was my side hustle. So I was working and outside sales at the time for Big Pharma. And I developed a business plan and wanted to test it. And so I started coaching folks on the side. So I would work during the day and then take coaching clients in the evenings and on the weekends to help them be more organized and productive. And that was probably 1213 years ago. And then I went to graduate school, and in graduate school developed the assessment that we use with our clients on productivity, the productivity style assessment, because what was happening when I was coaching folks, is that the one size fits all productivity tools and strategies didn't work. Not everybody's an analytical, linear thinker. And so we I needed a tool to help me understand how people thought about their work. So I could then create custom solutions. And then from there, started building out a team of coaches and trainers as we scaled the company, and started working with larger corporate clients. And then I've already added the last part of the journey, which is around the employee engagement and this the cry from our clients from what do we do? How do we reconnect and find meaning and purpose in our work? So we started our businesses about the same time it's kind of cool. 13 years ago, yeah, by the end of the to be 13 years. So you started as a side household, right. And I love that. And one of the most common ways for our listeners and most entrepreneurs to grow business is to use your job as your startup funds. If you're doing that we see you and a big High Five to our listeners who are, you know, working on it now. And you found something that was really resonated, which was this piece around productivity and I love what you said there that productivity isn't a one size cookie cutter, just follow this formula and you will become more productive. You You found some nuance was needed. And when you created that nuance, and people can go check it out, we'll put a link to the show notes in the show notes for the productivity style assessment, you found that people like needed nuance and to be understood about how they're wired and how they think. And as he started to, you know, we've got into the productivity conversation, things took off, is that fair to say? it is fair to say, and you know, what else, I think and your listeners will probably resonate with us. The other reason it took off is because people felt seen. Because when I came in, and then later, my colleagues, the assessment as an awareness tool, and in that we were helping them dial up their own awareness around how they thought and how they processed information and how they thought about their time and getting things done. And in that, we were able to help them see, we see them and they see themselves and then really embrace who they are, instead of fighting against it and saying, I have to do it this way. And that's very empowering way to work. Well, I love that listeners, you know that I have my spiritual highlighter. So I want to highlight that Kirsten was able to notice that people were feeling maybe scrunched in boxes, you're supposed to be productive by doing X, Y, and Z. And they were struggling to fit themselves into those boxes. And here, somebody came and said, No, you get to be you. And you can find productivity. And that took her global. So just notice that listeners something very important there about helping people feel seen and listened to. So you learned about the productivity styles. And he wrote a book about it. And that book was called work simply and it like took off. Right became a best seller and like Carson inner team or something like all over the place, right? Yes, yes. I mean, and you know, your listeners know this man, entrepreneurship is one step forward, and then to back and then one to the left, and then one to the right, and then you go forward a few steps. So it's not a perfect linear journey, but unlocking and differentiating ourselves. Unlocking the power of authentic expression of self was powerful. And having a tool, a research based tool. That was the only one and still is the only one in the marketplace really helped grow the brand and grow the business. That's what set you apart, it differentiated you and your work. Is that fair to say? That is fair to say. So suddenly, you're like, in these conversations, all these big companies, and you're building out a team, and you're in Fast Company, and you're in the New York Times, like what would you somebody who's starting to get left, you've had quite a bit of momentum in your career. And I love our young entrepreneur, they're hungry, they want to make the world a better place. They're doing such incredible things. That's the fastest growing part of our listeners, Kirsten, so somebody who's got a good idea, they're starting to get some feedback from the marketplace that they're onto something. But they're not quite like on to their second book, and they haven't been in the near times or Fast Company out, like what would you say to that person who's right in that phase of like, the wind is under the wings? And it's starting to take off? What were some of the like, steps to the right, that you didn't anticipate or the back steps or oopsies, that maybe you can share with them that they don't have to make because you've already made them? Yes, I want to say one thing to encourage. And then we'll talk about missteps and left steps and right steps is, what is really important, and I'm not sure it's always talked about with entrepreneurs is building a base. So I'm going to use a running analogy, because I'm a runner I ran in college, you got to have a strong foundation from which to work. It's the same principle and yoga. And this means you show up and you're at the end of your mat and consistent daily practice. And as a runner, it meant logging the miles building a strong base that you could go faster and longer. And so right now, if you're starting out and you've gotten that proof of concept and the market is responding, it really is just consistently doing the work and being on your mat and doing the runs because that base of experience is absolutely vital. And that experience is what then gives you the story to share share with Fast Company. It's the white paper that earns the opportunity for that next door to open. So there is maybe it's not as glamorous but I think it's so important to just run the laps beyond your mat and build That solid foundation. Love that curse. And I'm a trail runner and I live in New Mexico. And, you know, people like how do you do these incredible adventures last fall a buddy of mine, we did the, the Zion, try the Zion traverse trail. That's where you run from what we did trail running from one side, Zion National, to the other. And we are taking pictures literally running through an ancel atoms, like, you know, photo because he took a lot of pictures in Zion. And people are like, how do you do that? I'm like, well, we did, you know, 46 miles in two and a half days, and you just have to be in really good shape you have to put in, right. And some of those miles are gorgeous. And some of those miles aren't. But like, you can go for a nice hike and get out of your car and like, you know, go for a three mile hike and get back down. But like to run the Zion traverse. It's very vigorous, and they're like sand. And you know, it's quite an adventure, you just have to, like put in smiles to like, be able to do something like that. And it's not the answer that people necessarily want here. They know, I'm a biohacker. They're like, Did you take some supplements that allowed you to run? Because I know, I know, I put in a lot of money.
Paul Zelizer 21:10
Right.
Carson Tate 21:12
So putting in the miles is important. And then the two missteps that I've made along the way. One is around hiring people who I really liked, and try to fit them into a job. And then hiring people who didn't exactly have the skill set that they said they did. And I ended up learning the hard way. So the first one is, I see the best in people and see potential. And early on, I was guilty of meeting someone, they were referred to me for a position, I could see the potential. And I would hire them and try to make them fit a job that they just really didn't want to do. So we didn't have intrinsic motivational fit, they didn't have the skills for and they also didn't necessarily want to do the work to uplevel their skills so that they could do the work. And it's painful, it's expensive, credibly humbling. And then the other one on the hiring mistake, and I've done this twice, you would think I would learn after the first time. But apparently I needed a second lesson I got a second round was hired. And it was in a sales capacity to folks who said they could do things that they didn't, they weren't capable of doing. And maybe their resume was accurate. Maybe it was not, but they weren't able to perform what was required on day one. So your people I know I've made some mistakes, both in hiring and also in who I collaborate with the desert, you know, just look at the budget of any company. And it's like usually the single biggest, you know, expense in any company. And energetically I would say it's also like the biggest contributor to getting lift or not, who your people are and how they fit. So yeah, I'm sorry, you've had your hours, and I've had quite a few of my own. Yeah. And I think it's an important part, a pall of both personal growth and development and business maturation. I know in all of these, I had an opportunity to look at me my piece of the action and look at where I needed to grow and develop. And then I got to look at it with my from a business perspective and what was needed for the business to grow and have learned now take it very slow. In our hiring process, we have a very long, methodical hiring process. And when possible, we really love the opportunity to collaborate and work together if possible, before bringing someone on to the team and a full time role. Yes, one of the best pieces of advice I ever got, as to Yeah, find some way to do a project together before you hire or sign a legal document that you are now in collaboration with somebody and yes, so grateful. I'm so grateful and the people that I I'm the last time I told somebody that he was like, that's so smart. Of course, you know, giving me flack about it and like I was leaned in and we're collaborating right? And the people who are like why would you want it you know, then I'm like All right, go extra slow pump. Extra says he doesn't understand what's you know, on the table and wants to like called business dating. If somebody doesn't understand the value of business dating then Extra slow pause. Yeah, yes. And you know, it's one of my dear wise mentors always tells me get out. It's, it might be urgent, but it's not an emergency. So you might have a need real, what feels urgent need to hire that person, but it's not an emergency. So you don't have to move into firefighter emergency mode and go too fast to your point, you can take your time. Such good advice. So let's do this Carson, I want to hear about the new book and what the company is doing now. But before we do that, I just want to hear a quick word from our sponsor. Do you have something that is about making the world a better place, and you want it to help more people, and you want to live a good life have a good income while you're doing that? If that's the case, one of the best ways I know to do that is podcasting. And let me tell you what, the average podcast episode is 43 minutes long, actually 42 minutes and 43 seconds, but we can round that up and say 43 minutes long, you have time to go into the nuances and the layers in the full spectrum of what you do, as opposed to like a 13, word meme, Instagram or something like that. Audiences on podcasts, they're hungry for new ideas. They want nuance, they want depth. They want people who don't oversimplify things. And audiences on podcasts tend to be higher educated, make more money. And they're natural leaders, their audience, their group of friends and colleagues look to them for new ideas. So if you've got something that is out of the box is about helping people and you want it to grow, I invite you to take a look at the web printers podcast success team, where we help people learn how to do this, whether you want to be a guest or a host or both. You can find out more at aware printers com forward slash podcast dash success. And thank you to everybody who helped sponsor this podcast by being in the podcasting society. So person Talk to us a little bit now get this new book. Right. So let's start there. Tell us about own it. Love. It didn't make it work. Yeah. So the premise of the new book, so if we have a disengagement epidemic, that I suggest is consuming the hearts and minds of the US workforce. And it has been this way for many, many years, and there's been a one to two percentage point change, it's time to do something differently. And so the prevailing wisdom is that if you want to move the employee engagement needle, focus on what the company can do what the manager can do, absolutely important. However, there's another person in this relationship. So the premise of my book is that the employee employer relationship is a social contract, which means it's based on give and take. And that means both parties are responsible for the health and vitality of that relationship. So if we only address engagement from the perspective of the employer, we're missing a very important vital part, the employee. And so I'll come at this as what do you the team member, the employee need to be fulfilled and engaged at work, so that you can then enter into this relationship and help together to create a very vital, healthy relationship that serves both parties, as well as the company and the customers. And I would say even more broadly, the community in which the business does work. I love that idea of it being a social contract is beautiful. And we've been blessed. We have some episodes out already. And some episodes in the can, one by Art Bell, who started the comedy channel while he was inside a media organization and went to his bosses and said, there needs to be a comedy channel. He didn't like his job. And he said he was really interested in comedy. And he said, there needs to be a comedy channel in the world. And they said, Yes, right. So yeah, just hearing the wisdom, kind of through a number of our thought leader guests that that relationship wants a little more participation and, and care and attention from everybody who's involved there. And the idea of having it be thought of as a contract person. That's, that's just, it's genius. Really. Well, thank you. And I would suggest gives back to where I started with the business. It's about seeing people and empowering people to relay in this instance name and claim what it is they need and want to be fulfilled and engaged. And that sense of agency and ownership is training. formative not only of their life, but think if we go back to their family and they're engaged, they're healthier, the health care cost, and then the organization is going to benefit. That's a very say rich, transformative experience when that agency is restored to that individual. I think about we were joking about it a little bit, but it's not a joke, Carson, when I get to interview somebody, like getting ready for this interview, I don't write my notes and stuff, but like setting up the podcast, little studio I have and getting my mic out. It's like, I I'm like a kid like bouncing and my Tiger talk to Carson, there we go. I don't know, we're gonna talk about exactly where we're gonna have a great conversation. And then we can share and people who don't know your work, like confined it, and then they send emails to you and to me, and like if we do our job, and like, it's just, I love what I do. There's no, we're right, in this moment that I'd rather be. Now later today, I'm going to go run in the mountains. I'll be happy there, too. That's not like, I'm not sitting here in this moment wishing I was there. Right? And that's the piece the you call it living fully right? What would you say to somebody who's in that place, they're not quite ready to walk away, we know that they're still in that side hustle phase of things, or for whatever reason, they need the health insurance in the middle of a pandemic, to somebody who's like trying to figure out how do I be more proactive? And what if I'm not getting a lot of support from the organizational structure that I work in? It's, I am disengaged, I would like to find a way to love what I'm doing. And I'm feeling a little stuck here. Help me out. Kirsten, what would you say to that person? Mm hmm. So I've got three things. The first one, just hang with me is that any job can be your dream job. Because you define the dream. So we go back to there's no one size fits all, which is a persistent theme in my work. And that this, you define what loving your work looks like. The second thing I would say is it is a social contract. And you are valuable and needed, because your skills, knowledge and experience, you bring or give those to the relationship, and your organization needs you. And so in that, that means there's some power and an opportunity for you to use your voice. So it's clarity and knowing that any job can be your dream job, because you define it to you've got the voice that you can use an exercise and have power. And then the third is getting clear on what fulfillment and engagement looks like for you. And so I talk about it in five pillar areas, my new book, you admit that you actually need recognition. So we admitted and identify your reward and recognition needs. we align your strengths, so get clear on your strengths, and then align them to the organization's goals so that you can do more of that work that lights you up and that we were talking about makes us so giddy today, you develop new skills to continue to grow, cultivate authentic relationships, because none of us work in a silo. And then the fifth pillar is to design your work for your meeting. And now, if you were disengaged, you might not need all five of these pillars you need to go where it really resonates first with you. But these are the five elements that most of our clients have to address in order to create that fulfilling, rewarding work experience. For listeners, I'm just gonna make it easy. If you're disengaged, just go by Carson's book. That's why she wrote it. a really long time. Great, great suggestions person really, really simple and very resonant. When I think of the process. You know, when I was a burnt out social worker trying to figure out what's coming next, you know, that was very, very, I didn't have your book, but it very resonates with the process of harvesting my skills, understanding kind of where I was trying to get to, and that informed what I needed in terms of support and help and here we are 13 years later. So yeah, I go get the book listeners. And one other thing I would say about that, that your listeners who are in that side, hustle guy straddling the line, if you can do this work, this clarity work, before you leave, you're going to even be more successful, because I just did a class and I had two entrepreneurs in my class on my love your work class. They're entrepreneurs like What are you doing here, you're an entrepreneur, like, I don't love my work anymore, because they've lost sight of these five pillars. And they also hadn't started. They've never really shaped their work their company to support their own fulfillment and engagement needs. Person Talk to us a little one of the reasons people listen to the show, in addition to finding out great books, but you should go by listeners, they want to understand how things work as a social enterprise. So Alright, we talked about these two books, and they sold well, or at least the first one sold really well. And the second one's getting great traction and may sell very, very well, even better than the first. So they understand that part. Talk to us a little bit. What are some of the other things that you do at working simply who hires you? How did you? How did they find you? What are some of the ways and working with people one on one? Is it whole organizations Talk to us a little bit about the nuts and bolts of arkinson? Yep, so we work working simply in three, pillars equip, empower, and inspire. And these are our core focus areas. So in the equip pillar at working simply, this is where we offer training programs, both in person virtual and online on productivity, we equip you to be successful. So these are strategies and tactics. And in this equip pillar, with our training programs, we work with individuals, so an individual might purchase an online program, we might work with a small to mid size business with a team. And then we work with some large fortune 500 companies where we run a series of training programs. And oftentimes, our productivity programs then become part of their leadership development or new manager program. So that's the equip the empower the employee engagement pillar. And this is where we offer training and coaching and consulting. So the training programs for an individual or a team, how can we own and love our work. And that training is the same delivery online, virtual instructor led and then instructor led, then we'll also do one on one coaching. So we'll have individuals that will come to us that want to work one on one with our certified coaches, to really help them unlock their fulfillment and happiness at work. And then we'll also offer consulting programs with companies who want to take these five pillars or concepts and really imbued them throughout their culture, either the culture of the team or a division or the whole whole organization. And then the third pillar, the legacy pillar, this is one on work one on one work with our executive coaches. So this work is with executive senior leaders, who are really looking for that impact and legacy. And we just do one on one coaching in that pillar. And give our listeners like, give their sense of the team working simply, it's not just Carson anymore, right? So I have excellent chief of staff who is my right hand, we obviously got the CFO. And then we have a team of consultants and coaches that are certified and our methodology and our approach. And they serve alongside us on our client engagements. And at this phase of business person, like no books going out in the world and team members and, you know, big companies and legacy leadership kind of coaching like what, what's some of your growing at work as the Founder and Managing Partner at working simply, you know, given that you're 12 or 13 years in and you've got a reputation now and things are, it has its own kind of flywheel effect, it's moving and it has been for quite some time. How is being a leader in this phase different than being a leader five or 10 years ago? Um, so five or 10 years ago, we'll say 10 years ago, it was your the trainer, the designer or the bookkeeper or the leader, I guess the vision keepers,
Paul Zelizer 39:26
All the things.
Carson Tate 39:28
The things right volume, I you know, when your listeners know, they're all like, yes, we know what she's talking about. And so today, my role is the leader is about the vision and also ensuring that we are honoring and living into our core values, and that every person who experiences our work has that same affirming empowering, transformative experience and feel seen because that is Very important to our work. Nice. We're in this confluence of crises between COVID and the economic crisis. And as we're recording this, you know, I live in New Mexico, we've just had the worst week ever, for COVID-19 cases, disrupted our economy and how to shut down before and now there's a conflict, are we going to partial shutdown again, or not? Like we are in an incredibly point in time, and as somebody who's thinking about productivity, and what's happening inside of companies, and like, there's been a big disruption in the workforce for huge numbers of people all around the world, how are you thinking about your work in these times, and also like what's happening for the average person who's going to these going to work in these time. So it's a squeeze, right? off the bat of the old structures, in terms of how and why we work, the lens on looking at it through have been disrupted. So used to commute to work in a car on a train, and now it's in your fuzzy slippers used to go to a building, I'm probably not going to a building going to a kitchen table used to connect in person, now we're doing it over video. So in the span of weeks, we have had revolutionary change that at any other time period could would have probably taken years. And so what excites me is the tremendous opportunity for team members and leaders to proactively create a more conscious, equitable way of working. That's the opportunity and all the fault lines, we've got enough cracks, and enough folks are now open and awake to wasn't working that well, for everyone that I think we have an opportunity, I don't think we're going to go back to everyone has to be in the office from nine to five, I think we'll see more flexibility. I've seen more authenticity and transparency from leaders, when you have to get on a call and your kids bouncing up and down and the dogs are barking. It's a very humbling experience. That's a good thing. I don't think our team members will be willing to tolerate this artificial veneer when they've seen beyond which means I get to bring more of my whole self to work. So it's hard change is always hard. But I see tremendous positive opportunity, instead of conscious, equitable way of working. I just stopped us like universe. Can we have more of that? Please? Please?
Carson Tate 42:47
Yeah. So much more of that as wanted and needed on planet Earth. And thanks for all your many years dedicated to that vision, Carson. When you think about where we're going, right? We're in the, like you said this, like incredible time of disruption. And one of the biggest changes in the workforce in our lifetimes, like all just happened. It was there already things in motion, but certainly this confluence of what we're dealing with right now, when you think going forward, kind of what's on your radar, what are you thinking about going forward for you personally, Carson, for your company, for the clients you work with? And also just like, what's happening in the world of work in the world? What are what are you thinking about cars? But I'm thinking about this conscious and equitable way of working. I mean, that's on the forefront of my mind. And it's how can you what I think is how can you and your team, empower others to use the disruption and create positive change? So we have shifted our training topics and we're talking more about brave leadership and how do you make digital or remote work work for you all aspects of you. So I'm a mom of a daughter. School is a challenge and work the challenge how do we meet people where they are, we're rethinking productivity even more and pushing on our client organizations to move from an output. It's that busy work is there's reports some pre meeting for the meeting, hate to impact results only work, which is a really pretty radical in some organizations shift and helping our organizations and leaders get clear on what success looks like. Because if we can define success, clearly and empower our team members to get there without micromanagement and a lot of busy work that is transformative for that human as well as far as Organizations, please let me know how I can help because I share your vision. When we've talked a lot about work simply and the productivity in the new book, one of the things we haven't talked about yet is live fully. What does that mean, especially in these times to you, Carson, and what is it? What do you hold in your heart when you're working with an individual, a leader, a whole team, a whole company? What are you holding in your heart about living fully? Well, what I hold first is that it's the opportunity for let's say, I'm working with you, Paul, one on one, it's the opportunity for you to fully express who you are at work, but also in your personal life. So knowing that you're an avid runner, and trail runner, the lift fully for me would be supporting you. So that you've got capacity, time capacity, physical capacity to go do those runs, that you can do them free, not worried about your to do list or your next appointment or a client engagement, that there's the freedom for you just to be on the trails. And for me personally, what living fully means, particularly in the pandemic, is can I just stay in the present moment. So today, I was walking by our front window, and I saw this beautiful blue bird taking a bath in a puddle. I was like, you're gonna sit here and just look and just love this moment versus racing up the stairs to run to the next thing. But a beautiful story between parenting and working, right? It's an it's so easy to just be like, Where did today go? I did a lot of things. But I feel like I was a passenger in my own life. Very much. Love that passenger. And I don't want to be the passenger right now. Exactly. As opposed to like, I had this fabulous conversation. And then I worked with a client and then I wrote a newsletter. And then I went for a trial, right? Like, that's who I want to be. And I'm not always that person. But that's who I want to be. And that's what I want for you. That's I want for every listener, like every human I touch, I hope in any small way I can contribute to like you're feeling like you're there. And it's like, here we go, right for a newsletter, or an interview or a client session or a trial run, let's do this is what I hope to contribute to. And that's the essence of living fully. Right, the living fully is the juice and then the enthusiasm to be in at all. And be in all of it what it is in your life all those moments. Carson, I could hang out with you and talk to you all day. But I wouldn't do that to you. And I won't do that to our listeners. If there was something you were hoping we would get to in our conversation today. And we haven't touched on it. Or there's something you'd like to leave our listeners with as we bring this conversation to a close an action step. Certainly. You know, maybe go check out that productivity assessment or is there something you want to leave people with as we bring this to a close? I was thinking about it and I Yes, go buy the book. If that speaks to you check out our website, Carson Tate calm and working simply calm for resources and tools to support you. And I would want at one end with the dream job. Particularly now if you're an entrepreneur, doing the side hustle. If you're in a job you don't love, if you're just trying to keep it all together. Any job. Any job can be your dream job, because you define the dream. And with that courage, and the clarity that will come anything is possible. And the world needs you and what you want in your dream job now more than ever.
Paul Zelizer 49:04
Carson, thank you so much for being on the show today.
Carson Tate 49:07
Thank you, Paul. I appreciate it.
Paul Zelizer 49:15
Thanks, everybody, for listening. Before we go. A quick reminder, we now drop two episodes a week, early Tuesdays and early Thursday mornings. And we love listener suggested topics and guests. So if you have an idea, go to the aware printers website, go to our contact page and take a look at what we're looking for. Kind of we tell you right there, here's what we're looking for. And if you've got an idea that fits that please send it in. We love serving our listeners and who you want to hear from and the topics you would like us to be talking. For now. I just want to say thank you so much for listening. Please take really good care in these poignant times. And thank you for all the positive impact that you're having in our world.