249 | Holistically Supporting People Coming Out of Prison with Coss Marte
Our guest this week on the pod is Coss Marte. Coss is the Founder of Conbody, an impact oriented fitness brand that uses non-stop, bodyweight, prison-style workouts. They proudly hire formerly incarerated individuals as their instructors.
Resources mentioned in this episode include:
Episode with Coss Marte on Employment After Incarceration
NOTE: While it’s not perfect, we offer this transcription by Otter.ai for those who are hearing impaired or who don’t find listening to a podcast enjoyable or possible.
SPEAKERS
Coss Marte, Paul Zelizer
Paul Zelizer 00:02
Hi, this is Paul Zelizer, and welcome to another episode of the Awarepreneurs podcast. This podcast is all about the intersection of three things, conscious business, social impact, and awareness practices. Each episode I do a deep dive in with a thought leader in this intersection. Someone who has market tested experience, and is already transforming many lives. Before I get into our topic, and our guest today, I have one request. If you could go over to Apple podcasts or whatever app you're listening to the show on, hit the subscribe button, do a review, it helps tremendously. Thanks so much. Today, I'm thrilled to introduce you to Coss Marte. And our topic is Holistically Supporting People Coming out of Prison. Coss is the founder of Conbody, an impact oriented fitness brand that uses nonstop bodyweight prison style workouts. They proudly hire formerly incarcerated individuals as their instructors. Coss, welcome to the show.
Coss Marte 01:02
Thank you for having me, Paul, I appreciate it.
Paul Zelizer 01:05
You guys are doing awesome work, I can't wait for our audience to learn about what you're up to. So before we get into that, we're called to wear printers cost. And one of the ways we like to get to know you is to ask about a resiliency or a wellness practice that you personally use to resource yourself for this really important work.
Coss Marte 01:25
I think obviously, you know, fitness is my lifestyle, I try to work out at least four or five, maybe six, maybe sometimes every day of the week. And and I try to try to push myself when I'm when I'm doing it. And that's how we work out inside the prison walls and outside, you know, in the studio and our program and with our members, you know, so I push I push it to the limit. And it's a good way for me to like just escape. It's the only time I pretty much don't have my phone in my pocket. So I'm away from technology. I'm in in tune with my body and I'm just focused.
Paul Zelizer 02:07
I’m a runner Coss. So when I'm running and just like listening to the breathing and your heart beating, and you're sweating, and you're like connecting with nature, same thing. It allows me to step back into the connected life that so many of us lead in a different way that if I didn't have that pause and that like focus, yeah. So the founder of a brand called Khan body i There's an interesting story there cos Yeah, mine. Brigade. Let's go there. Right, like so. There. Obviously, there's was a close encounter with the prison industrial complex there. Tell us a little bit about that story.
Coss Marte 02:49
Yeah, I mean, I've been in and out of the system. Since I was 13 years old. 13, I got caught dealing with a couple bags of weed and from there just went into a spiral where I was in and out of jail multiple times. And and the last time was when we got shut down. We started thinking about other ways. So I was I was running one of the largest drug delivery services in New York City. I was making over $2 million a year by the age of 18. And I had over 20 people working for me, was a pretty crazy operation. We went from, you know, sitting on a corner, bodega and a milk crate, you know, to now you know, driving the highest one of the highest value cars around and just like delivering to, you know, Wall Street people, you know, we were not, you know, I grew up dealing crack on a corner to people that were using crack and then I creased the profit margins. I was selling it to people on Wall Street, you know, and I started doing a different product. So yeah, I mean, it was crazy operations.
Paul Zelizer 04:07
And somewhere along the way, you wound up inside and like, had you been already like connected to a fitness lifestyle before you went to prison? Or is that something and a lot of people that's one of the ways they work with just trying to stay sane and deal with the stress and the lifestyle of being inside.
Coss Marte 04:27
Ya know, when I got locked up, the last time I got charged as a campaign 23 years old that was sentenced to seven years in prison. I was not working out at the time I was highly overweight, getting care or didn't even think I had any health issues because I was not seeing any checkups. I was not concerned about my health at all. All I thought about was just making money. And so I basically got locked up and that's when the first time I I heard that I had a whole bunch of health issues, doctors told me my cholesterol levels were such in high levels that I could probably die of a heart attack within five years, and being sentenced to seven years. And, you know, being told that I probably had five years to live, I'm like, I can't die in this place. And so they recommend it to eat better and work out. And obviously in prison, you don't get the best food. So I worked out obsessively I, I would I remember, like, putting garbage bags over my body and having like a, like a fat to on the prison yard and running the yard and just just working, I was working about out about three hours a day. And eventually, I lost over 70 pounds in six months. And I took that yes seen workout routine that I was doing in my presence. So running in the yard, I took that same concept. And once I, you know, I started working with other inmates. And I started this like, workout program, you know, in the prison yard, and I helped over 20 inmates, there's over 1000 pounds combined, it was, it was not like, I didn't think I was in a startup business behind it, it was just an idea of building camaraderie with each other. We just went out there and just worked out together. But it was not towards the end of my incarceration, where I had an idea that, you know, I'm going to start a business behind this.
Paul Zelizer 06:30
And that's incredible at 20 People losing 1000 pounds. That's, that's huge. And I love that you're more focused on impact and helping people then like, let me see how I can turn this into making a gazillion dollars like this was really born of this is an environment where there's a lot of suffering, and I want to be of service here. Is that fair to say?
Coss Marte 06:54
Absolutely, absolutely. I mean, I feel like I'm rich without materialistic things. You know, I don't I don't need the items and material of the world to feel wealthy, you know, and I feel like I already have everything I need, you know, of food and clothes, family, shelter, you know, and I'm meeting the basic necessities and, and I'm, I'm doing okay for myself, and I'm hoping others do the same.
Paul Zelizer 07:28
So at some point, you get out and like, walk us through that process. Like, you get out you really rebooted your lifestyle. These all this weight. I imagine working out three hours a day. Probably pretty fit by then. I have to match it right? Because a big part of your life, right?
Coss Marte 07:47
Yeah, I was I came out with a vengeance and hungry to get out there and start calm body. Like that was just like my idea. I'm like, I'm gonna start this prison style bootcamp.
Paul Zelizer 07:58
So you knew it when you got out. You're like, Alright, I'm ready to turn this into a business.
Coss Marte 08:02
Yeah, I so before then I ended up in solitary confinement, about a year before my release. And this is after I like how to deal with all these inmates, you know, lose weight and get fit. And so while I was in solitary, that's when I started contemplating what I really wanted to do and, and I came up with somebody in that prison cell. And I wrote out many business plan exactly what I wanted to do when I came home. And so I took what I wrote, put it in an envelope, and I came home and I started doing it but being released, you know, that first day, it's, it's a shock, you know, I remember them, you know, giving me an envelope, you got an envelope for $40 You got a parole ID, and they open up those gates. And it's literally the that the taste of the air, the smell of the air smells different between that gate and the outside gate. It's just it's so weird. You know, it's and I remember coming home and I missed out that whole social media wave, you know, I remember going in with a with a flip phone, flip phone. And we had like, Myspace back then I remember when MySpace started I created a profile page and and, you know, that's what we did. And I got locked up and I came home and it was just a shock of you know, you need Instagram, you need Twitter, you need Facebook, and you all these social platforms, and I was just like, it's so it was overwhelming. But I started catching up pretty quickly.
Paul Zelizer 09:44
So like, walk us through what what has an impact oriented entrepreneur like coming out like what were entrepreneurship can be challenging for anybody have it like seven years inside and coming out? Like what were some of the special Rare, unique challenges that somebody coming out faces when they're trying to start a business or
Coss Marte 10:05
starting a business is probably the hardest thing I've ever done. And I'm doing it again, in a new venture, but that's a side note. But, ya know, it's been, it's been crazy. You know, coming home, like, I had no money. I had no real business acumen. You know, I, I just had the grit. And I think that's word. That's what all I needed. And that's what I believe, you know, anybody needs just just be ready to get a million nose and just keep getting up and keep going. You know, and, and, but that's what I had. And that's what I think made me survive. You know, the entrepreneurial route, but coming home, like, first, I didn't have any space. So I don't, you know, I started doing classes in the park. I didn't have any money. So I, I had a created LLC, but I couldn't get business insurance because of my, because of my criminal record, I was actually being quoted, my first quote, for insurance was $30,000 a month. Oh, god, yeah. Like, how do I start a business, you know, with no money and, and because of my background, I have to pay this much. It was just insane to me. But I kept, you know, running into people and learning and, and I basically use the same transferable skills that I use for in the streets, and then use them in a legal business, I made paraphernalia of cards, you know, and I started marketing on the subway and, you know, making announcements and telling people to come and, you know, there was days that, you know, people told me, they texted me that tell me, they're coming, and I'm the only one out there, you know, and nobody's showing up, showing up, you know, and so it kind of deterred me, but I just kept showing up and kept delivering a great product, and from one person to two people to three people. You know, I started growing, and today we've trained over 70,000 people. It's been a crazy, crazy time.
Paul Zelizer 12:30
Like, walk us forward, when did you start to feel like, alright, this is real. This is how it's not only an idea, but this is like, there's something I can point to, and there was revenue coming in, and you could like, comfortably feed yourself and have a roof over your head, like, give us give us some sense of like, what was yeah, how long was that? So
Coss Marte 12:51
so first of all, I needed a regular job, because fitness was not paying the bills. And so I remember coming home and I made a resume and I went out to every store in Midtown Herald Square Times Square, you know, just go on to any shop that I could get any type of retail job, just low level job, you know, that's all I wanted. And I kept getting denied, I kept getting denied. That was a three time felony felon. And that's what people know me as, you know, like, I'm not gonna amount to anything, and I'm not, I'm not hireable you know, so I just kept going. And then I started working off the books, cleaning. So basically, my uncle was on the books, clean these hotel rooms. And what I did, it was like cleaning these hotel rooms pre opening, so they would they had construction work. And so I went under his name and started doing his work and he was paying me $8 an hour while he's getting paid like 25 sitting at home watching TV. So yeah, that's what I that's what I did. And I kept doing that for a little bit. I did an internship at the Goodwill and was creating resumes and, and then afterwards, I started cleaning apartments for somebody. And that was my hustle side hustle. I was just cleaning apartment, doing fitness. I was doing three to four fitness classes every single day. Morning and evening. And that became that became the routine. And it was not until 2015 When I I took that that leap of faith and I was still not making enough money in fitness but I was making okay money and and I was doing you know, pick You know, jobs cleaning jobs here and there. And so I said, You know what I'm, I'm gonna go full time with this. And yeah, it was like two and a half years until I took that leap of faith.
Paul Zelizer 15:13
I'm so sorry, cost that it was so hard for you. And there were so little support in this transition coming out and anybody who's listening to this, there's any way you're in a position to help somebody who's coming out, find a way to earn a living that can pay the bills, and help them build the skills to be in the world and support themselves. And if they have a family can't encourage that enough. The way that folks who are formerly incarcerated struggle to create a life and a basic livelihood is just, I'm so sorry, we failed you and fail so many people and that it was such a stressful transition for you.
Coss Marte 16:03
It's okay. I mean, I there were, I'm not gonna say I did it myself, you know, but it was, it was it was stressful. It was it was hard. But I did take advantage of different opportunities out there, you know, those different organizations, you know, that, you know, they did, they're still out there, like fortunate society, defi ventures, you know, career gear, like nonprofit organizations, but been working in criminal justice space for a long time that had been, you know, at that time, it was, it was hard, you know, that you go into these nonprofits, you know, they try to pitch you as much as they can to different employees. And, you know, and, and they get a lot of nose themselves, you know, and sometimes they get yeses, but I took advantage of them. And some of them, you know, connecting you mentors, you know, shout out to my main mentor, Michael Rothman, he, like sat down with me and, like, taught me i basic Excel, like I had no idea, you know, what Excel and learning Google and YouTube and a lot of stuff like he took out the time and, and taught me that. And that change, changed my trajectory for.
Paul Zelizer 17:17
So walk us forward, like, what does combat it look like? Now in 2022, and coming out of COVID, I imagine that might have had a bit of an impact. But just like, if you just took a camera right now and said, Here's a snapshot of what combat it looks like, how many like in person classes, you're doing stuff online, like just give our listeners a sense of what does it look like now?
Coss Marte 17:43
Yeah, so since, you know, since the start of this, I've hired over 50 people. And I think this is my proudest at that we have a zero recidivism rate. So everyone that I've hired has not gone back into the system. And I keep, you know, I think the reason why that happened is just because I've been there 24 hours, you know, like anybody's in any type of trouble, or, you know, is thinking about, you know, doing substance, like, pick up the like, I'm 911, like, call me, and, and I'm there, you know, and that's, that's what I've done. And that's why, you know, I've been a success on that front. But on the fitness side, I mean, we've gotten a lot of support from my clients, you know, I've, you know, like I mentioned, we started with just one person in the park and an extended a, you know, to over 70,000 people virtually in person, we have our own gym in the Lower East Side, and this exact same neighborhood where I grew up that got locked up at and I'm probably going to die. But, ya know, this is this, it's been a crazy adventure. During COVID. This specially was was crazy. We actually pivoted right away to doing online and it saved us. And so we have these live, we have this live stream platform. We pay $15.14 hours a month to also watch our pre recorded videos. So anybody could do you know, our workouts in a small constrained space with your own bodyweight, no equipment, and you know, with your favorite, formerly incarcerated trainer, you know, to get that prison body you have always desired get that calm body. So that's what that's what we did, we quickly pivoted. I remember a day one COVID They told us, Hey, you got to close down and I'm like, I'm not closing down. And there was like, you have to close down and then I read an article and I was like, damn, I gonna close down. And how and I had a class. I remember it was like, in the afternoon, it was like 12 in the afternoon and I was like, What am I gonna do with these people? It's still cold outside. I had in New York and March. And I was like, You know what I'm gonna, I'm gonna send them a link, a zoom link. And so we did the Zoom link thing. And it worked and people, people loved it. You know, we had a great turnout virtually is expanded us, you know, worldwide now. And we've had 1000s and 1000s of people join our platform that's just been a crazy successful.
Paul Zelizer 20:30
So in a moment, I want to hear more about the specifics of how you're working zero recidivism rate, my gosh, I don't know if I've ever heard that before cost. I think there's some folks who are listening that would love to hear more about that as well as where combat is going. Let's do that right after we hear a word from our sponsor. I'm excited to announce that we have a new sponsor for the pod. Saybrook University. Saybrook University prepares students to challenge conventional thinking in business, social structures, mental and physical health and more. They have innovative online and hybrid programs to help students become part of a global community. They offer certificate, Master and doctoral programs, and they're guided by renowned faculty with years of experience in their respective fields. Saybrook is committed to helping students achieve their full potential, and their sacred community is deeply rooted in this humanistic tradition. Sacred graduates are transforming healthcare, providing organizational leadership, developing sustainable practices, and caring for populations and be open to business and non business majors like, say bricks 100% online Master of Business Administration Program is designed for students who are passionate about conducting business operations guided by the principles of sustainable social impact. Their hybrid online Doctor of Business Administration Program is designed for experienced professionals who are interested in exploring and applying the most recent research and theories regarding organizational and social systems change. You can learn more@saybrook.edu, there's a link in the show notes. And thank you to Saybrook University for sponsoring this pot. So costs in the second part of the show, we like to get a little more granular, in particular, tell us about this incredible result. You're hiring people who are formerly incarcerated, you're trying to help make this transition coming out easier with a well paying values align job like like, give us a sense of what is that like? And how does that work? When somebody is a client of con body? Like how are they thinking about their instructor who they know is formerly incarcerated? And how is that part of why somebody chooses to get involved with con body as opposed to one of the other gazillion other fitness possibilities out there?
Coss Marte 23:03
Man, it's been a journey. So long question, but, you know, hiring and keeping the stat so low, I mean to zero. It's been a it's been a journey, I knew we were I don't even know where to start there. Because it's just been so many, so many barriers that my my staff had to face, whether it was housing, clothing, food, you know, parole and criminal justice issues. You know, there's been, there's been times where I get a call from a parole officer, you know, and asking me, like, Where's, where's this person at five in the morning, because they're not allowed to leave their house till 7am. You know, and I'm like, or they're on the train, on their way to work, you know, and, and I'm wanting to do like, you know, they, they have these things called technical violations, you know. And so it's, it's really difficult to meet these guidelines. But I built a great relationship with the pro lawsuit office. And then also on how on the housing side, there was literally no times where I had I don't know, about five air mattresses. Were in the actual studio, you know, like, my train was a homeless. They're eating like we're living off of like peanut butter and jelly sandwiches. And you know, what a hot pot you know, we're making still ramen noodle soup survival kit, you know, like prison and I'm deflating these air mattresses at like 530 in the morning. So we can start classes at six, you know, and folding them up and greeting clients and, and making it look like you know about No, nothing's happening here. You know, this welcome, you know, and so it's been a journey. It's been a real journey and And, and there's, you know, we have a documentary coming out soon, I can't give too much of the details. But that's all I can say is that, you know, we've documented a lot of this, that we had to go through, you know, whether it was finding a retail space to operate. And, you know, it was, you know, that was a huge barrier of mine, because every time I filled out these applications to try to lease a spot, it was always asked that question have I've ever been convicted of criminal record? And I always had to, I always had to check that box. Yes, you know, and explain what it was. And so, you know, these landlords didn't want to take a chance on me. It was they, even the brokers that were, you know, trying to broker the deal with trying to, you know, tell him the landlords, I don't think this is a great idea. And then, and then on top of that, when I would tell him, like, what's the business plan with comp it? They were like, Are you kidding me? You know, they would, they thought it was not. And I remember, you know, I got really lucky with elder like, Buddha's lady. And she, she gave me a chance, she had a, she had a Buddhist temple, that she was renting out, and, and then under the Buddhist temple is a basement. And so we converted that basement look like a prison facility. So our location looks like a jail, a mini jail, holding cell, do you take it mug shot, you know, so we took the prison aesthetics, to fit the branding behind it. But you know, keeping that recidivism rate down, I was, I think, is just, you know, like I mentioned before, I was just a call away, I was I was 911, at all times, you know, of any things going down, you have any issues with your parole officer, officer, you need permission to do this. So that, like, I was managing all these people. And today, and you know, I have managers in a company, dealing with that, and resource managers and stuff like that. But it was, it was, it was all me, it was all me at the time.
Paul Zelizer 27:15
I remember that we did an interview with a organization that's well known in the space Homeboy Industries, their CEO, Tom Bozo. And Tom talking about how important it is, when you're helping formerly incarcerated folks make the transition into life on the outside and creating work that can sustain he talked about the power of belonging, and just helping people feel like there's somebody that cares. And when something comes up, there's somebody's listening and trying to help them navigate it. Like there's that same thing, everybody who's ever done any work around helping folks who were formerly incarcerated knows the barriers, or just the constant issues and the harassment and the challenges, etc. But somebody who's listening, and you can pick up the phone and say, Look, I supposed to teach a class, but my parole officer said, get my butt down here right now, or I'm going to be in violation, right? And somebody who could hear that and not freak out and like, okay, got it. You know, we got this, we'll figure out the class or I'll talk to your bro, just so simple acts of feeling like you matter. And you're part of an organization that cares, and how important that is. And here that same theme coming through with what you're doing with combat sup fair to say,
Coss Marte 28:33
yeah, absolutely, absolutely. I mean, Homeboy Industries does a really good job. With with that back, and really having somebody that cares. I think that, you know, there's so many organizations out there, and I don't want to backlash, you know, talk bad about any organization, because a lot of all the missions, but there's so many organizations that treats individuals coming out of this system as, as a number, you know, and I remember, you know, coming out, I did a did a year when I was 19 to 20. And, and when I came home, you know, I went to a nonprofit trying to seek for help, and I felt like I was just another number, you know, there were like, alright, you know, sign here, dot you know, cross a T dot, yeah, your eyes and, and just sit, and I just felt like I was being moved, like, like, it was cattle, you know, and nobody asked like, how you doing? You know, can I help you or, like, have a real conversation with me? You know, it was just, it was just, I don't know, it was it was very programmatic very. I felt like I don't know. It was just like one plus one equals two and there was no no feeling behind it. You know, it was very black and white.
Paul Zelizer 30:00
So I'll put a link in the show notes to that episode with Tom bozos, you could check that out listeners, in addition to looking to create a culture of belonging, and really trying to see the person, not just treat them as a number. Any other suggestions for folks who are listening cost who want to hire folks who are coming out of the prison industry in some way, shape or form? Like maybe they just, there's things they're trying to wrap their brain? How do I do this? Well, and any other tips? Or somebody who's in that position?
Coss Marte 30:33
Yeah, I mean, treat them like a regular human being, you know, there's going to be different skill levels, you know, some might know, you know, the skill that needs to fulfill the job. But as you know, they're willing to learn, I, I've, my retention rate for employees is four years, you know, like, there's no rope company out there that, like I say, their retention rate is that high that people want to stay in their company. You know, it's, it's, it's, I think, I've met the most trustworthy, most charismatic, and most like, hungriest people, they might not know, the technical aspect, but they're willing to learn, and they will go back home, and, you know, take notes and do their homework and study and do what they have to do to come back the next day and show off, you know, and so, I feel like, all you need to do is just give that person a chance, you know, not, not everybody is going to work out, I'm not going to tell you, you know, everybody come into the system is this, you know, redeemed individual, that that person has to find their, their redemption on their own, you know, that person has to be changed, but, you know, the, with, with someone, you know, being humbly, you know, approaching you and just asking for help. I mean, I think that's a real sign of change. And so, highly recommend people just, you know, giving people a chance, if you have any company, or you have any way of helping, like, I'll listen to that individual. And that's what I do every day.
Paul Zelizer 32:15
Any tips costs for if I, if I'm a founder, business owner, and I want to hire formerly incarcerated folks I wanna support and I'm like, trying to wrap my brain around, like, how do I languages? How do I talk to my clients or customers about what might come up for them? Right, somebody obviously is likely to have that box checked. How do you work with the community of clients or customers, when you're wanting to bring on formerly incarcerated folks as contractors or employees?
Coss Marte 32:49
I think every business is different. You know, I feel like bringing on somebody in today's age, like, it's more receptive, you know, people want to do a social good aspect behind their company, I think this will only help your company today, you know, before 2020, and before George Floyd, like I was, you know, I was not I was not getting nobody else and raising money. You know, I wasn't, I was trying hard, but nobody wanted to give me you know, financial backing, I had to figure it out and make it work, you know, and it was, it was extremely difficult, you know, but after, after that, I just feel like America has really opened up their eyes, you know, and how injustice system has been, and people have educated themselves and wanting to give back and wanting to hire people coming into the system could be a positive move for you, you know, and I feel like taking that step is there's there's a whole bunch of organizations out there that are nonprofit, like I mentioned, like Fortune Society to five ventures who are operating in multiple states. Even Homeboy Industries Anti Recidivism Coalition and La you know, there's so many and there's probably where some where you're at for that I hope to connect with and contact these organizations, you know, they have the the secret sauce, you know, they will refer, you know, their best candidate for that position.
Paul Zelizer 34:30
One of my favorite social enterprises in New Mexico where I live as a group called father's building futures, and it's formerly incarcerated dads, who, that thy father's building futures is known for having this incredible woodworking business, everything from cabinetry to caskets to if it involves wood and now some other things they've expanded but just creating a whole business of folks around creating awesome products. They're really high quality and And this impact of like, hey, let's help dads get a real job so they can be there for their families and help the next generation and kind of break that intergenerational cycle that when somebody goes into prison, it's one of my favorite social enterprises. Awesome work. I love it. I'll put a link in the show.
Coss Marte 35:17
Yeah, no, that's awesome. And on that stat, you know, like, that that's a very important work that they're doing because the incarcerated fathers or fathers that are coming out who have been incarcerated, your child is 70% most likely to follow that. That was that, you know, that. I think one of my biggest fears is that my 14 year old son ends up in the space even though I've showed him a great example. And, and their stats as as a Hispanic Latino boy, you know, that things are stacked against them on but, you know, I hope, you know, he keeps doing righteous, living that righteous path, you know, it's usually doing what he is doing now. So it's, I think, seeing a dad work and seeing your parents doing the right, they're gonna just follow that misstep?
Paul Zelizer 36:15
I'm so glad you could have that conversation with them. And so many young people don't have it. It's like happening, but sometimes there's nobody in their orbit that can have that conversation. So I'm so glad he has that with you. Yeah. So give us you hinted at one thing, because you're got some exciting things. One is this documentary. And I can't say too much more about that. But like, give us a sense, like, where's Khan body going? If you look ahead the next three to five years, what are some of the exciting things that are, you know, in your near term future?
Coss Marte 36:52
Yeah, right. Right now, I'm working on some exciting things. I'm working on franchising organization, bringing it across multiple states, you know, I'm working on on New Mexico, so, so PA, you know, hopefully we get a link up in person soon, then it's, it's been a, it's been a journey, but I see, I see things growing and the next five years, I want to hire just as many people coming out of the prison system as possible, and really highlighting them to the world and, and have that personal, you know, one on one interaction or group setting and see these individuals as leaders and untapped talent, I'm, I'm actually doing a TED talk this week, in Berkeley, and, and that's what that's my topic on top talent. And just tapping into these, these creative, you know, individuals and smart individuals that we take for granted that, you know, statistically, we all think, you know, they're just bottom of the barrel, you know, the worst of the worst, you know, we will look at you like media is always portrayed, somebody has been incarcerated as a predator, or somebody has come out and kill you and all that stuff. And so, I want to change that perception and highlight the positive work that they've done, you know, and even even the negative creativity, if you think about it that way, like, I'm gonna be talking about how these, you know, how we used to make wine in prison, you know, like, you know, coming up with the knowledge to do that, you know, or making a tattoo gun out of the CD player, you know, like, you know, the CEO of Amazon can do that. You know, we did that. So, you know, just just highlighting, so much work like that. Can't wait.
Paul Zelizer 38:55
I said this before we hit the record button, but do let me know when you're ready to come to New Mexico. Anyway, our network here can help. We'd love to have you here and, and if somebody's listening in, they're like, oh, franchising. I'd love to see you come to my state. Can they reach out and share their thoughts?
Coss Marte 39:12
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, we're working on on franchise deals right now. You can reach out at info at con body.com. For any inquiries on that difference. Awesome.
Paul Zelizer 39:27
Where do you think this space of using social enterprise we've mentioned a few names whether it's con body or Homeboy Industries or father's building feature here in Albuquerque space is growing like I didn't say this before. In this episode, but some of our listeners know I did a 15 My first 15 year career was in community mental health and trying to help with intergenerational issues. We have a young father support program helping young men who were incarcerated try to connect as dads when may but they didn't have the most helpful role models, etc, etc. So I've been in this space a long time, 30 years in one way or another, right? And I've seen the space grow like there are more people thinking about using social enterprise, to help folks who were formerly incarcerated kind of transition to living a good life. And what are you seeing in this general space? Like, does that feel true that there's more people thinking about this? And there was?
Coss Marte 40:24
Absolutely, absolutely, I mean, 10 years ago, 10 years ago, I was about to be released from prison, you know, and, and, yeah, there was nothing, you know, like, what's happening now, you know, where we're the movement, where people are more accepting what people are having conversations with us, you know, and listening, you know, and there's legislations that are that are changing, you know, every day, you know, to help us, you know, be human again. And I think that's the biggest thing, you know, when you came OUT out of the system, you just didn't feel it feel human. And that's why I call them like returning citizens, you know, we are just returning humans, you know, I don't want to even want to say returning citizens, because there's, there's people that are immigrants being released, and we need to accept them as they as they are. And people are opening up their eyes, you know, seeing these documentaries like that their teeth and all these, there's so many documentaries that we could find on on Netflix, or Hulu or whatever, to see the inequities that we've we've had to live for, for so long. And I'm glad that, you know, we're putting it out there. I feel like where we were very unique time to rewrite the script and change the trajectory. You know, we see prisons in New York State closing down, you know, we had, they were 67 prisons in New York state. Now we're down to 60. You know, but it's, it's gone in the right direction. And now they're, at one point, we had 20,000 inmates and Rikers Island, there's about 5000 incarcerated inmates in the whole city of New York, you know, so like, it's, it's changing. Let's change it.
Paul Zelizer 42:21
So, one of the questions, the main kind of group of folks who are listening to this podcast costs are folks who are wanting to get better using business or social enterprise forget. And it may not be around formerly incarcerated folks, they might have some other impact area, but but a lot of our listeners have a story in some way. They're relating to where you came from. And now what you've done is so inspiring, helping 70,000 People in franchising, making a documentary, like, you've learned some things about creating a social enterprise and overcoming some real challenges, structural challenges that you didn't have as much support as I would hope somebody like yourself would have when you're trying to start something, what would you say to somebody who's earlier on the journey of building a social enterprise that can really help in their area of impact, and particularly somebody maybe who didn't go to Harvard who, you know, doesn't have relatives that can say, here's a friends and family round of funding, here's a half a million dollars for your awesome project, right? Yeah, that wasn't the case for you. And isn't the case for a lot of our listeners, what would you say to somebody who's, who's really passionate about social enterprise knows they want to make a difference, but doesn't have some of the resources of somebody born tomorrow privilege.
Coss Marte 43:47
To tell you, the truth is gonna be hard. It's gonna be extremely hard, but it's gonna take a lot of tenacity, a lot of grit and, and just keep moving forward to make sure you know, your your business is something that that's needed. That's something that that's wanted, you know, I remember going to Brown University to this extremely smart class, MBA class. And, you know, we, they, these, they were coming up with so many incredible ideas. And I remember one kid told me, he's building this crazy software system. And I told him, you know, Have you have you reached out to any clients? So they are Have you done any market research on who wants this? is like, No, not yet. But you know, I know they're gonna want it. I was like, first step is just to ask if they want it, because you could go out to a million people and be like, This is not needed, you know? And I see that happening all the time. You know, where people build incredible products that you have in your mind. You think it's a great idea, you know, and so if you have any likes Social Enterprise thought, you know, like, go out there and do your market research, see who's doing it, you know, see, you know how you can make it a little bit different. And and just take the time. It doesn't have to be a sprint, you don't have to, you know, I, I've been doing this nine years now, this this companies that have hired 1000s of people in nine years, I've only hired a little bit over 50, you know, and but I feel like I've done a deep impact with each individual I had on the team. And yeah, I mean, yeah, that's, that's a little bit of my tips. I mean, I might, you know, add more there. But that's, that's, that's what I think you should get started.
Paul Zelizer 45:52
Super helpful. Because I get to hang out with you all day, you're doing all this work. And I know you're busy. And I know our listeners busy, I'm going to put the show notes to come bodyside some of the other resources, the Fortune Society, Homeboy Industries, bothered building future, all the great resources in the show notes. So that will get covered, we'll make sure people can find you in your awesome team. If there was something you were hoping we were going to get to cause, and we haven't gotten to it yet Conboy about helping people who are formerly incarcerated anything about that, or there was something you want to leave our listeners with, as we start to say goodbye, would that be,
Coss Marte 46:33
I'm always trying to close, you know, ABC is my, my motto, you know, so always be closing. So, you know, if anybody wants to, like, get fit, support us, you know, check us out workout with us, you know, just follow us on Instagram. You know, sometimes we put out feeds with our, our client or clients or, you know, employees stories. And so maybe one day you'll be inspired to, to get moving with us. So come support us. And I appreciate the platform for
Paul Zelizer 47:06
Awesome, thank you so much for being on the show cast. So appreciate it. Thank you. So that's all the time we have for today's show, folks, before you go. Just one quick thing, one, we love, love, love listener suggested topics and guests. So if you have an idea and say, Oh, I think I have a really good story for the podcast, go to our website. Go to the contact page, we have three simple guidelines of what we're looking for the right there. If you read them and you go check, check, check, send it on and we'd love to hear from you. For now, I just want to say thank you so much for listening. Please take really good care in these intense times. And thank you for all the positive impact that you're working for in our world.